User talk:Benwing2

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Template:scn-noun

There were 251 Sicilian entries in Special:UncategorizedPages, which turned out to be WingerBot leaving out a "}" when it rewrote this template. No module errors, because the result was inexecutable, but a whole lot of entries with broken template syntax instead of a headword.

I did my best to purge everything using the API sandbox and I think everything is back to normal, but there are 1,574 transclusions- so it's hard to tell. Category:Sicilian nouns seems to have stabilized at 1,749. It wouldn't hurt to check.

This is a good illustration of why bot-rewriting of templates always makes me nervous... Chuck Entz (talk) 19:19, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing this up and my apologies for messing it up in the first place. This error was due to a typo I made when manually editing the templates offline. I had assumed that if I made any typos they would lead to module errors or an abuse filter getting triggered about unbalanced braces, but I forgot that this doesn't always happen with template syntax (unlike with Lua, where this usually does happen). What I should have done was push each change manually (although that would have taken a long time ...). Benwing2 (talk) 19:30, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

add French to Module:Quotations

Could you add French to the 'hasData' table at Module:Quotations please? Saumache (talk) 21:00, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

Done. Benwing2 (talk) 21:11, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks! Saumache (talk) 21:14, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

Language code errors

These typos were easily fixed, but I'm listing them so you know they happened:

1. Chichewa: Template:ny-head: hy/ny (in template code- 503 mainspace transclusions)
2. Crimean Tatar: {{h|crn|pron}}/{{h|crh|pron}} (in öz, özü, özüm and qaysı)
3. Mauritian Creole: {{letter|mfr}}/{{letter|mfe}}; {{Latn-def|mfr|letter|5}}/{{Latn-def|mfe|letter|5}} in e

These all showed up in Special:WhatLinksHere/Wiktionary:Tracking/headword/incorrect language header, which has a few extra hits almost every day (2 are basically unfixable at the moment)- 500+ was a real surprise. Chuck Entz (talk) 01:03, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

Fuck, I seem to be getting careless. Thanks for fixing them. The hy/ny error was because I copied the definition of {{ny-head}} from {{hy-head}}; the other two were simple typos, as n is next to h and r next to e. I think I know how to avoid the adjacent-letter typos, which is to do search-and-replace operations where I have the operation itself copy the language code instead of having me separately type the language code in both the search and replace portion. BTW as I get older I notice myself frequently writing of for on, to for the, in for is, and other random cases of replacing one word, usually a function word, with another. I used to do that even as a teenager but the frequency has gradually increased over time. Not sure if you see the same thing happening. Benwing2 (talk) 01:21, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

Seeking Input

Hey Benwing2, I would like to seek some constructive advice or criticism on any issues you have for me, generally. I know you have opinions about my edits, and I know that I do not really see Wiktionary from the broader angle that higher-level editors do; I am super narrow focus. So I want to use any various opinions you might give me from your big picture view to try to enhance the value of my edits. Thanks for any time you give me. --Geographyinitiative 🎵 (talk) 03:14, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

It would help if you gave me some specific topics you're looking for input on. In terms of overall advice, the only thing I would say is that you have a tendency to jump to conclusions and then start doubting yourself and try to retract everything you've said. It would be better to proceed more slowly when writing your opinions and think through what you've written before hitting "Publish"; then, if you still feel the need to correct something you said, just post an update/correction rather than trying to retract everything. Think of a newspaper article; if a newspaper makes a mistake of fact where they should have known better, they generally post a correction, while if they make a mistake where they couldn't have known better (e.g. due to incomplete information), they post an updated article and let the previous article stand. Only in extreme cases do they retract an entire article (and usually it's a big scandal if/when that happens because it means a journalist fabricated the whole story). Benwing2 (talk) 03:21, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments. It's so interesting that you bring up this topic, this was not what I expected! You know, one of my higher goals on Wiktionary is to help create a community that will explore the topics that I am interested in. But I am myself am in essence the greatest enemy of the creation of that community, because I am too crude and backward and not friendly enough. Hence, when I try to delete, strike through, or otherwise take back previous posts, I am trying to exercise whatever residual authority I have over my previous posts to liberate Wiktionary from my mistakes, and create a more friendly environment that other people want to contribute to. I want professors, I want grad students, I want the best people. But I can't get them here if I've got a million silly rants out there. I discredit Wiktionary, hence I try to clean up previous posts. Moreover, this is not reddit, this is Wiktionary. The posts are not the point, the dictionary is the point. This is not the NYT and we should not treat posts with such seriousness that a retraction should be made or something like that. How do you think about this viewpoint? I'd like to know. I want to know because I need to connect with the community better to be able to improve my overall performance building the dictionary, and that starts with making people more comfortable with me. --Geographyinitiative 🎵 (talk) 09:42, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

I wanted to follow up on our earlier discussion. Looking back, I think I understand your point better now. I have also adopted the community consensus here: diff-- I have adopted the emerging consensus regarding old talk-page comments. Accordingly, I have stopped trying to remove or retract my old posts, and I have withdrawn my outstanding deletion request.

I apologize for my earlier attempts to delete old comments. I now understand why preserving the discussion history is generally considered important, even when I no longer agree with something I wrote. I will "strike through"- see my new edit diff

If you have any other concerns about my editing, I would be glad to hear them. My goal is to make constructive, policy-consistent contributions to Wiktionary, and I appreciate feedback that helps me do that. Thank you for your work on the project. (AI-assisted drafting) --Geographyinitiative (talk) 🎵 08:19, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2: I would like to request that you let me know if I am going to be banned for any long-term disruption and let me know any terms I would need to abide by to avoid banning. For instance, I can strike something out if you all don't like any previous removal I did, or if I removed any edit in the future, and you want me to keep it. That's okay! I will do it! I will figure out some way to comply. Of course, I do not agree that removing my own material is an actual violation of any Wiktionary policy, of course. But my failure to agree does not mean I cannot comply with what I see as unestablished rules of community consensus. There is just a danger there to me, because of the vagueness of the unestablished rules of the community consensus, that it will be used against me and then they will say "we told him that one time somewhere". I will misunderstand/misinterpret. However, I do not want to be banned, I want to comply with all rules, and I would like the opportunity to modify any behaviors or specific edits with reference to specific requirements or rules for me, if they are specifically laid out. I am taking these proactive measures to fully comply with any requirements so that I can continue to contribute to Wiktionary in a productive way long-term. I have done a lot of work that is at the top of a Google search for a given term, I want to keep doing that. Proper nouns may seem low brow, but I'm helping explain non-proper nouns as well, and I work on an area that people in Asian Studies have a lot of problems understanding obscure words- see my talk page- Anyone else struggle to read wade-giles?. Please do not let any blemish of mine wipe out the potentially meaningful components. Thank you for any help. --Geographyinitiative (talk) 🎵 21:58, 11 July 2026 (UTC)

@Geographyinitiative Sorry, somehow I missed your earlier message. Instead of "unestablished" I think you mean "established but unwritten". I can't think of any problematic behaviors other than the one you mentioned (removing previous comments that you no longer agree with), and your current solution of striking out but leaving things you no longer agree with is IMO fine. The only other possibility that would likely get you in trouble is inserting political messages into usage examples and quotes. I know you like to edit areas (like PRC-related terms) that are potentially politically sensitive; esp. given the unfortunate state of the politics of the US and several other countries, it would be best to make sure you avoid usage examples and quotations that express political opinions, even if they are written in someone else's voice, unless it's absolutely unavoidable (e.g. the term itself conveys a political message). One of the safest ways of doing that is avoiding quoting from controversial people (e.g. Trump, Xi Jinping) or from editorials and op-eds in newspapers, unless again it's absolutely unavoidable. Benwing2 (talk) 22:11, 11 July 2026 (UTC)

Okay, I will try to just strike out stuff from now on. I am trying. I thank you for your reply. --Geographyinitiative (talk) 🎵 22:15, 11 July 2026 (UTC)

Template:nn-noun

After spot-checking Wiktionary:Todo/Lists/Entries with missing headword lines#Norwegian Nynorsk, I get the impression that, as of 3 days ago, its only function is to take half a dozen or so parameters that it doesn't use and place the entry in Category:Pages using invalid parameters when calling Template:nn-noun. That's a bit of an exaggeration, but it does look like too much for me to sort through right now. Chuck Entz (talk) 22:41, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

Ugh, the cause of this was an unclosed HTML comment. Benwing2 (talk) 22:49, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

And also, yes there seem to be a lot of params that are being used but not supported; I assume it used to take a different syntax and got changed at some point without cleaning up all the old uses. Benwing2 (talk) 22:52, 4 January 2026 (UTC)

Category:Irish verb inflection-table templates

Link: Irish verb inflection-table templates
Hi, I was wondering if you could please make WingerBot replace all instances of l|ga, <sup>†</sup>, and ‡ in the pages of this category with l-self|ga, {{sup|†}}, and {{sup|‡}} if possible.
I saw it carry out similar edits to some Assamese noun declension templates about a week ago. Though, it broke the category links as seen here which I think I had managed to completely fix. Sorry I didn’t bring them up here at the time (which would have been the right thing to have done in hindsight). Saighneánach (talk) 19:45, 6 January 2026 (UTC)

This is another similar unconstructive edit I found which seems to be the last. Saighneánach (talk) 20:05, 6 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing the errors I accidentally introduced when doing search-and-replace. I'll make the above replacements ... and be more careful not to affect category links :) Benwing2 (talk) 06:18, 7 January 2026 (UTC)

Thank you very much for doing the replacements. In relation to {{ga-conj-abair}}, I'm ok with the conversion to {{inflection-table-top}} (ITT); there’s a discussion at WT:AGA about whether to convert all the conjugation table to ITT and which style to use (which is what inspired my Bot request). Saighneánach (talk) 19:50, 7 January 2026 (UTC)

Translation adder again

Here is a simple Python script I wrote to generate the nesting variable for the translation adder: https://gist.github.com/atlight/5c0f6fdc846cea5609064003a4ced569 If you don't have any problems with it, I will replace the current nesting variable with this script's output.

I'll now work on fixing the sort order. This, that and the other (talk) 09:57, 18 January 2026 (UTC)

Looks good to me, thanks! Benwing2 (talk) 18:53, 18 January 2026 (UTC)

@This, that and the other You might want to update the data in the script with the latest from the current version of my script as I added some more language groups (for obscure languages) late last night. I'm probably going to run with this version. Benwing2 (talk) 19:02, 18 January 2026 (UTC)

Updated the Gist with the commit you made today, and updated the adder data file with the new nesting table. This, that and the other (talk) 08:21, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks! I'm in the process of going through all the multiword languages and updating the script accordingly; almost all of them are very obscure. I should be done by tomorrow at the latest and if you can plug in that version, it should be the last one. Benwing2 (talk) 08:26, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

Yes, I figured you would have further updates. Let me know.

As for sorting (best to continue that discussion here, away from BP): I can confirm that my "English collation" approach and a JS rendition of your "NFD-strip" approach produce identical results except in three cases:

1. "Magɨ" is sorted after "Maguindanao" when using NFD-strip (in JS at least) but correctly before "Magoma" using English collation
2. Possibly different sorting behaviour regarding spaces and punctuation (e.g. whether "Mid Grand Valley Dani" comes before or after "Mid-Southern Banda" - this also affects the placement of N'Ko) - note that I did add stripping of spaces, hyphens and apostrophes to the NFD-strip approach but I only added apostrophe stripping to the English collation approach. Can you confirm your code's sorting behaviour here?
3. Lects whose names differ only by accentuation (e.g. Cat:Karipuna language and Cat:Karipúna language). It seems like your implementation treats these as equal, leading to the risk of unstable sorting. However, this is currently a therotical issue only, as none of the 4 pairs that differ only by accent have any lemmas or translations.

This, that and the other (talk) 12:02, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

As for #2, get_L2_sort_key() does remove spaces and hyphens from the sort key, so I added that to my sort key. Specifically, it removes the following spacing characters, which I have added to my sort key: [-\s'"ʻʼ]. The only difference now between my sort key and get_L2_sort_key() is the list of combining characters, which is more extensive in get_L2_sort_key().

As for #1, the thing is that ideally we want the translation adder and get_L2_sort_key() to match. I agree it's better to sort Magɨ as if written Magi, but I'm not sure the exact rules used by Javascript's "English collation", so I'd have difficulty duplicating it either in Lua or Python.

As for #3, such cases shouldn't exist. Can you list the four pairs that differ only in accent? We need to rename them to avoid this.

Also, I just pushed what should be close to the final update for my list of language groups; I finished going through all the multiword languages. Any further updates will be tweaks. Benwing2 (talk) 23:35, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

Okay. Perhaps the best thing to do is for you to supply the full list of LOL language names sorted into the order you think they should be sorted in. I'll make sure the adder matches it.

Here are the pairs of lects that differ only by accent:

guq	Aché	(cat, lemmas, translations)
yif	Ache	(cat, lemmas, translations)
aru	Arua	(cat, lemmas, translations)
arx	Aruá	(cat, lemmas, translations)
bfa	Bari	(cat, lemmas, translations)
mot	Barí	(cat, lemmas, translations)
cma	Mạ	(cat, lemmas, translations)
msj	Ma	(cat, lemmas, translations)
vor	Voro	(cat, lemmas, translations)
vro	Võro	(cat, lemmas, translations)
tci	Wára	(cat, lemmas, translations)
wbf	Wara	(cat, lemmas, translations)

This, that and the other (talk) 23:57, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

(Incidentally, I thought there were only four pairs because I was looking at a diff of the two sorting approaches. While "English collation" always sorts the non-accented letter before the accented one, "NFD-split" is inconsistent, so only some pairs were sorted differently.) This, that and the other (talk) 00:06, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

See User:Benwing2/sorted-list-of-languages. I fixed the sort key so the langname itself is used to break ties; you can see by looking at the history of this page that it changed the order of some languages (e.g. Apma vs. Ap Ma, Abu vs. Abu', Madi vs. Ma'di, etc.; IMO none of these pairs should exist as such, without a disambiguator). Benwing2 (talk) 00:20, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks, that was useful. I have been able to replicate this ordering precisely in JS. Implemented at Special:Diff/89256104/89263153. This, that and the other (talk) 02:26, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

And updated nesting: Special:Diff/89256385/89263285 This, that and the other (talk) 02:37, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks! Benwing2 (talk) 04:28, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Hi. Adding translation or translation requests for Latin (la) is no longer working with recent changes. Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 02:47, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

@This, that and the other Can you look into this? Could it have something to do with handling Latin as a script name? Benwing2 (talk) 02:49, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

It must do. Whoops! Let me fix it. This, that and the other (talk) 03:47, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

@Atitarev I take it this is only happening on pages which also have a "Serbo-Croatian > Latin" translation? This, that and the other (talk) 03:50, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

Yes. A similar clash happens with other nested names, such as Arabic, Hebrew, etc.

The bug with nesting translations is never fixed either. E.g. adding "Serbo-Croatian/Cyrillic" adds into "Mongolian/Cyrllic" instead.

For example, if "Cyrillic" appears in multiple places. The preview is fine but it saves under "Mongolian" instead of "Serb-Croatian" or "Old Church Slavonic" (usually from the lower in the alphabet into the higher one). Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 04:23, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

@Atitarev okay, the situation is worse than I realised.

I have made a quick fix to allow addition of Latin translations in a box that has a pre-existing Serbo-Croatian > Latin translation. This is a very dirty fix, as the translation preview will appear in the wrong place - but it does get saved correctly.

But clearly some serious work is needed on this part of the translation adder. Unfortunately I don't have time to do it immediately, but I will make a note of it. This, that and the other (talk) 04:30, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

Need help with de-verb

Hi, I need help with de-verb/de-conj, maybe this is already possible, but I can't figure the syntax out. I'm trying to fix the conjugation over at radfahren. This is a weird case where the verb (noun-verb combination) is separable, but the separable noun part is still to be treated as a normal German noun when separated, thus capitalized. radfahren => "ich fahre Rad, du fährst Rad" etc. At the moment the module generates lowercase forms: fährt rad etc. These forms are not correct (and never have been). Thanks! Jberkel 13:50, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

I tried {{de-verb|Rad.fahren<fährt#fuhr,gefahren,führe.sein>}}, this works, but leaves the infinitive uppercase (Radfahren) in the headword line. Jberkel 13:52, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

This will require some updates to the code. Internally, the code distinguishes a "prefix" (when the separable part comes before the main verb) and a "postfix" (when the separable part comes after), but doesn't currently provide a way of specifying them separately. One way I can think of is to simply lowercase the separable part to form the prefix; that way, we'd get postfix " Rad" but prefix "rad". Does that always work or are there verbs written with a capitalized prefix? Benwing2 (talk) 23:41, 19 January 2026 (UTC)

No, verb infinitives (+ participles etc) are always lowercase so this would work. Jberkel 07:15, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Consolidating duplicated Arabic letter forms

Hi,

On pages such as ج, the template {ArabForm} is used multiple times under different language entries, without any particular reason why some are included and others not. They all display the same thing. Wouldn't it be easier just to list the forms of the letter once, at the top of the page? I'm thinking of something like this. kwami (talk) 00:45, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

I agree. I'm not sure why it's being done the way it is. I could potentially imagine some display differences between e.g. Persian and Arabic but I think in those cases they are already using different codepoints. Benwing2 (talk) 01:21, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Either that or they're different hands that wouldn't be captured by the user's default Arabic font. The template currently has no way of displaying such differences regardless. If the variation is sometimes notable and can be captured with Unicode (or with images), we could always add that capacity to the template and show it under the relevant languages after consolidating the basic template to the top of the page.

I'll go ahead and restore that edit then. I don´t have JSWB on Wk, so it will take a bit of time to extend it to other characters. kwami (talk) 01:53, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Sounds good. Benwing2 (talk) 01:56, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Here's an example of one that maybe shouldn't be changed: ؠ. But most are straightforward. kwami (talk) 02:24, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

Arabic alphabet's done. Not yet all of the basic Arabic block, though. kwami (talk) 07:57, 20 January 2026 (UTC)

ں is another I'm leaving alone. kwami (talk) 10:42, 21 January 2026 (UTC)

Casing in symbols

r̃ is a phonetic symbol but has casing. AFAICT it's not used in orthography except for disambiguation in dictionaries. It's labeled as a symbol because it's phonetic, but to show the casing I need to template it as a letter. Is that okay, or does it need to be fixed somehow? kwami (talk) 07:09, 23 January 2026 (UTC)

Hmm, is it normal for NAPA to have casing in their phonetic symbols? Benwing2 (talk) 07:12, 23 January 2026 (UTC)

There's no intrinsic case. It's not uncommon to have casing in an ad hoc NAPA-based orthography, or as in this case a modified actual orthography, but it's not usual. We can't really say it's Hausa othography, but it is comparable to older English dictionaries where English orthography is retained but with added diacritics to specify pronunciation. kwami (talk) 08:53, 23 January 2026 (UTC)

Maybe we could list it under Hausa as a letter and with a lexicography tag. This isn't specifically Hausa, though, that's just the example we have. kwami (talk) 09:20, 23 January 2026 (UTC)

I have thought about this and I think we should have both a Translingual NAPA entry (a symbol, no case) and a Hausa entry (a letter, with case). Benwing2 (talk) 01:15, 24 January 2026 (UTC)

Okay. I'll mark it as lexicographic. We could probably add other languages with the same, but the Hausa illustration should be enough to show people what's going on. kwami (talk) 01:25, 24 January 2026 (UTC)

Linking from header

At Gǃòʼé_ǃHú#Juǀ'hoan, the header is red because it's capitalized and the individual words have articles but in lowercase. Is there a way to specify casing so the template both displays and links correctly? (Alternatively, perhaps I could move the Juǀ'hoan entry to lowercase gǃòʼé ǃhú, but I imagine this isn't an uncommon problem.) kwami (talk) 06:54, 25 January 2026 (UTC)

Yes, use the |head= parameter, something like {{head|ktz|noun|head=[[gǃòʼé|Gǃòʼé]] [[ǃhú|ǃHú]]}}. This is the standard way of handling this. Benwing2 (talk) 06:59, 25 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks. kwami (talk) 07:00, 25 January 2026 (UTC)

Before I fix them, should definitions for symbols avoid starting with "The symbol for"? E.g. at ♍︎. I'm thinking they should be e.g. "(astronomy) Virgo (constellation)" rather than "(astronomy) The symbol for the constellation Virgo." kwami (talk) 09:32, 25 January 2026 (UTC)

I'm not Benwing, and maybe he'll differ, but I'd favour the first option. If the POS is "Symbol", which it will be, then we are already declaring these as symbols elsewhere in the entry.

As an aside, I am perplexed at your use of {{ng}} in entries like ǃHãunu. The definitions written here are glosses, no? A non-gloss definition of ǃHãunu would be "Used to refer to the brother-in-law of ǂKá̦gára." or some such. This, that and the other (talk) 05:01, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

I thought I was told to use {ng} in such cases. I guess I misunderstood. It does read better without the italics. kwami (talk) 05:08, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

I've started converting the sign/constellation defs to glosses. kwami (talk) 06:15, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

What of ǂKá̦gára, should I also remove the ng template there? kwami (talk) 06:21, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

Yes, because the definition is a gloss (it defines what the word is) rather than a non-gloss (defining how the word is used, etc.). The info about the moon should be removed or at most placed in a usage note because it's not part of the definition. Benwing2 (talk) 06:24, 27 January 2026 (UTC)

ϟ#Zulu

Someone objected to the obsolete Zulu entry, which is based on being a graphic lookalike to the Greek. Since I created the entry, would it be a problem for me to delete it and recreate it on an unsupported-character page, without waiting for the deletion request to resolve? kwami (talk) 09:53, 3 February 2026 (UTC)

{{pagename}}

Is there any way to make it capitalize the first letter of an entry? Or perhaps an alternative template? For example, in dog, it would come in handy to have it displaying “Dog” instead of simply “dog”. ~2026-82697-7 (talk) 14:42, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

{{ucfirst:{{pagename}}}}. — Sgconlaw (talk) 15:14, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

Thanks! ~2026-82697-7 (talk) 15:20, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

old comma issue

This is from 2022 so I don't know if it's possible or worthwhile to look for other examples, but I notice that here WingerBot erroneously converted [[hätte der Hund nicht geschissen, hätte er den Hasen gefangen]] (link to "x, comma y") into [[hätte der Hund nicht geschissen|hätte er den Hasen gefangen]] (piped link displaying only "y" and pointing to only "x"). - -sche (discuss) 05:10, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

This was not a "manually assisted" edit (which would imply a one-off error), so there may be other such cases, and I should still have the old logs on my old laptop so it should be possible to dig them up and look for other cases. I've been meaning to copy over all the stuff from my old laptop so this may incentivize me to do so. Benwing2 (talk) 05:17, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

Just wanted to report a similar small punctuation issue. WingerBot erroneously added a full stop here in 2024 after the audio template. Vuccala (talk) 17:52, 3 August 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know. I modified the script that adds the final periods to take into account the occurrence of a {{listen}} template. Benwing2 (talk) 19:58, 3 August 2026 (UTC)

BTW I checked that particular run and this place is the only such occurrence of this issue. Benwing2 (talk) 22:56, 3 August 2026 (UTC)

See also addition reversion

Hello,

You had reverted an addition of a "see also" template to a Spanish entry I had created as "not useful". I had made a typo (I had left off the acute accent in error); I have added the template back with its intended entry in place of the one that was there. A few Spanish verb forms differ from one another only in the presence or absence of that acute accent. StrangerCoug (talk) 08:42, 9 February 2026 (UTC)

@StrangerCoug Hi, because of the typo there was a module error, which is why I deleted the {{also}} template. Make sure to check for module errors after saving; they show up in red when you preview or after saving, and they're visible in Category:Pages with module errors (or CAT:E for short). Benwing2 (talk) 04:09, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

I will slow down a little more so I can play closer attention to the error next time—with the accelerated creation links, it's relatively easy for a human to make a lot of entries quickly, and the also templates I have to manually add. StrangerCoug (talk) 04:17, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

cln nl Low Saxon cardinal numbers

I noticed today this edit. I fixed it, and any other Dutch Low Saxon (or German Low German) entries which may have been edited in this way will also get fixed as they are merged, but I'm letting you know in case similar edits were made for other languages: there are other languages that that kind of search-and-replace would stumble on, e.g. "Hindi Dogri". You may already be aware of the issue; I recall a discussion about the fact that we have various language names that superficially contain other language names, and the ways in which this complicates search-and-replace of language names with language codes, happening somewhere recently. - -sche (discuss) 03:56, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for reminding me of this issue. I do remember someone mentioning this before but I'm not sure whether I ever fixed the script. I'll take a look; it shouldn't be too hard to fix, you just have to work from right to left looking for the longest matching name. I'll also look and see if I can find any other such cases. BTW if you need botting to convert e.g. German Low German nouns to Low German nouns, I should be able to do that fairly easily. Benwing2 (talk) 04:08, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

All right I see what the issue is; my script requires a language name or code and works one language at a time, but doesn't check to see if the language name is part of a longer language name. Benwing2 (talk) 04:11, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

It looks like all the Dutch Low Saxon errors in that 2024 run were cardinal numbers: drij, een, elf, negen, tien, twaalf, veer, vief, zes. No German Low German cases (at least in that run) were incorrectly converted to German. Benwing2 (talk) 04:22, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

Seems like you already converted all those numbers. Benwing2 (talk) 04:24, 10 February 2026 (UTC)

Capitalisation in {{cy-adj}}

Hi, I think you corrected {{cy-mut}} so it would show correctly capitalised mutated nouns. Would you be able to change {{cy-adj}} so it does the same? Currently Gwyndodig shown with a soft mutation of wyndodig in {{cy-adj}}! Arafsymudwr (talk) 19:11, 12 February 2026 (UTC)

Translation sorting

Your bot is renaming Adyghe -> West Circassian without sorting it to the right place in the list of translations. West Circassian is now first in the alphabetic list. Vox Sciurorum (talk) 01:54, 15 February 2026 (UTC)

@Vox Sciurorum That step comes next ... Benwing2 (talk) 02:18, 15 February 2026 (UTC)

I'm renaming Kabardian -> East Circassian then I'll sort all the results properly. Benwing2 (talk) 02:19, 15 February 2026 (UTC)

Bot request for Cornish

Hello, I have seen your bot WingerBot carry out similar tasks so I would like to request that it replace all instances with {{kw-mut-cons|foo|bar}} with simply {{kw-mut}}, in order to deprecate the former. All instances requiring additional input have (I believe) been replaced manually, just need a bot to carry out the arduous task of replacing the simpler instances. Thanks! Tesco250 (talk) 22:23, 15 February 2026 (UTC)

@Tesco250 Should be done. Benwing2 (talk) 02:28, 16 February 2026 (UTC)

Quotation template and other replacements (February–March 2026)

Hi, could you please carry out the following replacements when you have time?

• If |page= or |pages= used and |year=1959 not already added, {{RQ:Achebe Things Fall Apart}} → {{RQ:Achebe Things Fall Apart|year=1959}}.
• If |page= or |pages= used and |year=1919 not already added, {{RQ:Marshall Squire's Daughter}} → {{RQ:Marshall Squire's Daughter|year=1919}}.
• {{RQ:Morley Haunted}} → {{RQ:Morley Haunted Bookshop}}.
• {{RQ:Nesbit New Treasure Seekers}}: the template has been updated. If there is a number in the |1= position (formerly the chapter number), remove it.
• {{RQ:Trollope The Way}} → {{RQ:Trollope Way}}.
• {{RQ:Wallace Ben-Hur}} → {{RQ:L. Wallace Ben-Hur}}.
• {{RQ:Wilkins MM}} → {{RQ:J. Wilkins Mathematicall Magick}}.
• {{Navbox}} → {{navbox}} (they have been merged).
• Thesaurus:sexually aroused → Thesaurus:sexually aroused.
• |1=en in all quotation templates → |en.

Thank you. — Sgconlaw (talk) 14:06, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

FYI, as of the Feb 1 dump, there are 15,115 instances of |1=en in {{quote-*}} over 10,658 pages, and 23,330 instances of |1=* over 16,683 pages. I'm not sure where all of these are coming from; I wonder if Quiet Quentin or some other quote-generating gadget (@Ioaxxere?) is generating quotation templates this way. Benwing2 (talk) 03:20, 19 February 2026 (UTC)

Hmmm, no idea. Interesting. I keep coming across them. — Sgconlaw (talk) 05:27, 19 February 2026 (UTC)

I added another request relating to {{navbox}}. — Sgconlaw (talk) 17:55, 25 February 2026 (UTC)

Suggestion

In the entry 'effeminate' could you edit the first sense?

Of a boy or man, exhibiting behavior or mannerisms considered unmasculine or typically feminine

I think it's broader and more accurate, thank u! Logenman (talk) 00:47, 22 February 2026 (UTC)

Hi, you should bring this up in the tea room if you're unable to edit the page yourself. Benwing2 (talk) 00:49, 22 February 2026 (UTC)

bot request to move infinitives first on non-lemma entries like tremere

I think it's obvious that the Latin infinitive is more important than a secondary form of the 'second-person singular future passive indicative' and we're doing people a disservice by having the latter first (which was done by @Kennybot). So could you change the order here? Exarchus (talk) 19:44, 25 February 2026 (UTC)

mismatched headers

As a followup to #Casing in symbols above, we have medieval scribal abbreviations like ꝯ, which people are placing under the header 'symbol', but with a 'letter' template because they have casing. I wanted to check before changing the headers to 'letter'. They aren't letters of the alphabet, but behave as such. There are others such as ꝝ that are matched as 'symbol', but if the first is changed to 'letter', for consistency the second probably should be too.

I guess a follow-up question would be, what's the deciding difference between a 'symbol' in a phonetic alphabet and a 'letter' in a unicameral alphabet? kwami (talk) 19:57, 25 February 2026 (UTC)

talk page

Hello Benwing2,

May I request permission to archive/blank my talk page? box16 (talk) 20:53, 27 February 2026 (UTC)

@Box16 Please don't just "blank" your talk page. Instead, copy the contents to a sub-page named according to the dates of the contents, and then delete the corresponding contents on the main page. See my talk page for an example. Benwing2 (talk) 03:29, 28 February 2026 (UTC)

Thank you for the information. box16 (talk) 05:35, 28 February 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2, in this post above, you politely request, "please", that an editor not do something that's actually not against the rules. So, in that same spirit, I want to do the same to you Benwing2: please stop requesting Wiktionary editors follow practices or rules which do not exist. I would say "please follow Wiktionary guidelines" and that's it, no need for extra taboos or moralizing etc. Please only advise people to follow the rules, not extra non-rules. And if you consider this annoying, because I'm pushing a non-rule request on you, imagine the people you're pushing non-rule requests on. Doesn't feel so good, does it? --Geographyinitiative 🎵 (talk) 10:56, 28 February 2026 (UTC)

Template:entryname

Why did you make this? —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 19:45, 15 March 2026 (UTC)

@Fenakhay: for visibility. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 05:35, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Language treatment

Hello, could you proceed with this request? I think there has been a consensus for some time regarding this as a minimum measure. I have been working on the language (family) and it should come in quite handy. Also pinging @-sche, who seems more active (hope everything is well with you). Jacaguoçãrana (talk) 00:03, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Adding 100000 West & East Circassian entries using a bot

Hi,

We exchanged some messages in https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wiktionary:Language_treatment_requests#Circassian one month ago. You said that you have a registered bot and scripts. I have almost 100000 entries in both West & East Circassian that I want to add to Wiktionary. I wanted to ask, if you can give me the dump of all West & East entries, I will modify them using a script of my own, and then I will re-send you all modified files + 950000 new entries. Adamʂa123 (talk) 18:03, 23 March 2026 (UTC)

Module:de-IPA

Hi, I was snooping this module cause I'm considering the possibility to implement it into other Wiktionary. But I found that you were working on a way more sophisticated version, but it didn't leave your user space, I want to ask you: is this project abandoned? Do you still consider it is a worth implementing module rather than do manual IPA transcriptions? Do you think in retaking the job someday in the future? What would be your advice for someone is looking for a automatic or semiautomatic transcription tool for this language? Tmagc (talk) 22:02, 2 April 2026 (UTC)

see discussion regarding the gerund in Portuguese

Hey, Ben! I've just noticed you were the one who added the entire "Participles" section to AP:Portuguese verbs 4 years ago. Special:Diff/70263704

Please see Appendix talk:Portuguese verbs#On the Portuguese gerund. o/ Emanuele6 (talk) 17:57, 3 April 2026 (UTC)

bot job

This poor guy is probably trying to manually add {{fr-IPA}} to every French verb form, which would take 24 years. Any chance you could speed up the process? —User:Vealhurl (talk 22:19, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

@Vealhurl: I don't know if you noticed, but Ben seems to have gotten really, really busy IRL and hasn't made an edit under any of his accounts in a month and a half. As for his bot, make that two months. Chuck Entz (talk) 03:51, 22 April 2026 (UTC)

OK, so Chuck, you make the bot!!! —User:Vealhurl (talk 07:08, 22 April 2026 (UTC)

You may be an eligible candidate for the U4C election

Greetings,

The Universal Code of Conduct Coordinating Committee (U4C) seeks candidates for the 2026 election. The U4C is the global committee responsible for overseeing enforcement of the Universal Code of Conduct. Elections are held annually, if elected a committee member serves for two years.

This year the U4C requires candidates to hold administrator rights on at least one wiki, which is why you are being contacted as you appear to hold this right. There are other requirements, such as candidates must be at least 18 years old and may not be employed by the Wikimedia Foundation or other related chapters and affiliates. You can find more information in the call for candidates on Meta-wiki. Additionally, the committee's working language is English; some ability to communicate in English is required.

The election opens on 18 May, if you are eligible and interested you have until 10 May to submit your candidacy. There will week between for candidates to answer questions from the community. Voting takes place privately in SecurePoll, successful candidates must receive at least 60% support. More information is available on the 2026 Elections page, including timelines and other candidacy information. If you read over the material and consider yourself qualified, please consider submitting your name to run for the committee. If you think someone else in your community might be interested and qualified, please encourage them to run.

In partnership with the U4C -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 18:32, 28 April 2026 (UTC)

(This message was sent to User talk:Benwing and is being posted here due to a redirect.)

Words of positivity

I want to let you know that you are missed and I hope that you are faring well; Cheers! TranqyPoo [💬 | ✏️] 03:33, 5 May 2026 (UTC)

Yes, just wanted to say I hope you're doing OK and that the Wikibreak has been fruitful. Do you think you'll be doing more bot work at some stage? No rush, of course. — Sgconlaw (talk) 12:14, 23 May 2026 (UTC)

Links to ؽ not working

Hi Ben. Hope you're okay.

For Azeri, the entry ێ noted that it's an error for ؽ, so to avoid a content fork I changed the def to

1. alternative form of ؽ

However, that incorrectly links to the unpointed ی article, as does the simple {l} link above. Do you see what's going wrong? If I manually enter it in the search window, it's directed correctly. kwami (talk) 23:40, 23 May 2026 (UTC)

deletion of Morag

Hi, I noticed you deleted the page Morag with mention of Manx. Was the Manx entry the only one on the page? Morag is a very common name in Scotland and I was quite surprised to find it without an entry on here. SaoiDunNeachdain (talk) 18:59, 28 May 2026 (UTC)

The deletion summary gives the entire contents of the page. There was no Scots or Scots Gaelic. You can re-create the page with new content- as long as it's not Manx. Chuck Entz (talk) 02:38, 29 May 2026 (UTC)

Bot overwrites without leaving record of change

The approach the bot takes to making changes seems to defeat a core feature of a wiki: the diff record does not record all changes from the most recent version of the entry. See this diff, which overwrote my change without it appearing in the diff record. This should be corrected. DCDuring (talk) 16:40, 4 June 2026 (UTC)

Wiktionary:AutoWikiBrowser/CheckPageJSON: Andrybak

User:Benwing, you seem to be an active admin who edits Wiktionary:AutoWikiBrowser/CheckPageJSON a lot. Could you please take a look at my request at Wiktionary:Beer parlour/2026/May#Request: add Andrybak to Wiktionary:AutoWikiBrowser/CheckPageJSON? —andrybak (talk) 22:54, 4 June 2026 (UTC)

bequadro, beqquadro, biqquadro

These had been listed as alt forms, but given the explanation in our style guide that 'alt form' is for orthographic differences, I changed them to synonyms. (And e.g. we list sparagus as a synonym of asparagus rather than as an alt form.) I see a lot of variant words listed as alt forms, though, so wanted to check in here before I come across more. kwami (talk) 20:29, 10 June 2026 (UTC)

icelandic cleanups

just FIY, it looks like some past wingerbot Icelandic cleanups have gone wrong, for example: Special:Diff/82808242/83138022. I've fixed some of them manually, but I don't know how many are still around. Jberkel 11:15, 11 June 2026 (UTC)

@Jberkel Thanks. I'll see how many more there are from my logs. Benwing2 (talk) 18:05, 11 June 2026 (UTC)

Module:pl-noun

Hi there. Just noticed that the instrumental singular forms for words ending in -isko and -ysko are coming out as -kem instead of -kiem unless you pass extra parameters, although it seems like something the template could do automatically. Other neuter words ending -ko seem to be fine (compare e.g. jajko). I had a look at the module but couldn't see where it was going wrong. Also pinging @Fenakhay, Vininn126 for info. Cheers, BigDom 21:18, 15 June 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2 and I are planning a rewrite of the declension modules at some point. Hopefully soon. That would I think the last big parts of Lechitic infrastructure to do. Vininn126 (talk) 21:22, 15 June 2026 (UTC)

OK thanks, good to know. For now I'll just add the inss=... parameter whenever I come across a word that's wrong. BigDom 21:24, 15 June 2026 (UTC)

Yes, this is the common practice. It's very janky. The old code is very spaghetti-owaty. Vininn126 (talk) 21:27, 15 June 2026 (UTC)

Hibernia

WingerBot somehow removed the crucial word—Ireland—from the non-code definition (diff). Aloysius Jr (talk) 13:30, 19 June 2026 (UTC)

That was me editing manually and making a mistake. I fixed it the way it should have been done. Thanks for calling attention to it. Benwing2 (talk) 17:49, 19 June 2026 (UTC)

Icelandic IPA

Hi,

AFAICT, Icelandic has word-final devoicing. That suggests that the transcription in this edit was correct before you changed the template. I don't know if allophony like that would be best handled by the template. kwami (talk) 07:04, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

It isn't that simple. Icelandic has no voiced stops at all, and fricatives and approximates (including /r/, /l/) are *sometimes* devoiced word-finally. Often the pronunciation begins voiced and ends unvoiced. You can hear examples of this in the Íslensk-Ensk Orðabók, cf. https://enska.arnastofnun.is/is/ord/55258/tungumal/EN and https://enska.arnastofnun.is/is/ord/30591/tungumal/EN. Since it is so context-dependent the normal convention is to used voiced fricatives, and that's what we follow in the module. Please don't try to override the module's output. Benwing2 (talk) 07:19, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

Eiríkur Rögnvaldsson 2020, for example, writes [mɛrð] not *[mɛrθ] for written <mergð>. Benwing2 (talk) 07:22, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

Okay. Wanted to be sure. kwami (talk) 08:04, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

module:lad-inflections

I tried to make verbal definitions for espia and it says ‘Lua error in Module:lad-inflections at line 252: bad argument #1 to 'format' (string expected, got nil)’.

I lazily made a few other pages just to make the verbal definitions: Module:lad-common, Module:lad-verb, and Template:lad-verb form of, although in retrospect I regret doing that because I think that I only created more work for somebody to do, and I’d rather not fiddle with it myself for the sake of fixing (so far) one entry.

You can tinker with the modules, leave them alone, or delete them. At this point I don’t care which, as long as it doesn’t mean that I’m in trouble again. I made a mistake and there’s nothing that I can do. — (((Romanophile))) ♞ (contributions) 14:26, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

Hi, it looks like you mostly copied the Spanish modules? Since they seem barely constructed I may just delete them. Benwing2 (talk) 17:31, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

Yes, Ladino is the language most closely related to Spanish, so copying your Spanish modules was logical, but I only adjusted them somewhat (like deleting the voseo lines) and I honestly don’t have the time, patience, or interest to fix them. If you don’t want to fix them either and would rather simply delete them then that’s fine; like I said, as long as I’m not in trouble again you can do whatever you want.

That said, I won’t know what to replace the verbal entry at espia with. — (((Romanophile))) ♞ (contributions) 19:25, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

I don't remember what got you in trouble but creating modules like this won't cause any issues. You'd want to replace them with a call to {{infl of}} that lists the appropriate inflections. If it's like Spanish it would be the 3rd sg pres indic and 2nd sg imperative, and I went ahead and made the change. Benwing2 (talk) 21:14, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

Catalan multiword/hyphenated stress

Hello, please double check the stresses added by WingerBot to Catalan nord-oriental nord-occidental [1] and any similar words affected. I'm guessing ,àl needs to be added but reading {{ca-IPA}} I also wonder why the final primary stress isn't automatic. Hftf (talk) 08:45, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@Hftf The intent was clearly to put secondary stress with [ɔ] on nord- and primary stress on (the last syllable of) oriental/occidental. It's definitely supposed to default to final primary stress for words like this; I suspect I assumed that hyphenated words are given separate stresses but they aren't. I'll take a look. Benwing2 (talk) 17:41, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@Hftf You are right about adding ,àl. I did that in a couple of other places and it looks like all other similar cases are already correct. In this case, the hyphen is considered a syllable separator but not a word separator for the purpose of assigning stress (because of unstressed pronouns that are attached with a hyphen), so the presence of a stress in one part of the word prevents stress from being assigned elsewhere. Benwing2 (talk) 19:12, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

Enquiry

Hi, I have seen that you have blocked the user Marlena3032 for a month. I have just noticed today that a user called NiggendraChodi who has coincidentally the same pattern of editing and this anonymous ip user : ~2026-39513-80. Is it possible to check if they are a sock puppet user of Marlena3032 ? Thank you. Have a beautiful day. Imranqazi90 (talk) 15:51, 13 July 2026 (UTC)

I am not a CheckUser. This would have to be done by @Surjection or @Chuck Entz. Benwing2 (talk) 21:20, 13 July 2026 (UTC)

I can confirm that NiggendraChodi and Marlena3032 are related and I've applied blocks to both of them. — SURJECTION ^{/ T / C / L /} 04:29, 14 July 2026 (UTC)

Thanks Surjection for the checking and Benwing2 for redirecting the message. In case I come accross such dubious accounts editing on pages I keep as watchlist, I will report them.

Have a great day ahead. Imranqazi90 (talk) 05:34, 14 July 2026 (UTC)

When to create redirects

Hi Ben,

A few years ago, I turned a rd into an article, as I had been told that we shouldn't use rd's on Wiktionary. This was recently restored as a rd, with a note that I need to stop doing this. I just came across a similar situation: ՙ was changed from a rd to an article, with the same rationale of avoiding rd's, then later deleted because as an article it did not have adequate content. As a consequence, it's not straightforward for a reader to figure out what this (spurious) character is for. Would it be acceptable for me to recreate it as a rd?

Thanks, kwami (talk) 18:29, 20 July 2026 (UTC)

Hi Kwami. When you say you turned a redirect into an article, what did you do exactly? We avoid hard redirects and turn them into soft redirects, not full articles. What was the content of ՙ before it was deleted, do you remember? Also when you suggest recreating as a redirect, how do you suggest doing this (hard or soft redirect) and to what article? Benwing2 (talk) 18:35, 20 July 2026 (UTC)

My edit that was recently reverted was for ٳ. Someone else had moved the original article from that deprecated atomic encoding to composite اٟ, leaving a hard rd. In 2023 I changed the hard rd to a soft rd, "Deprecated text encoding of اٟ", based on my understanding at the time. (At least, that's what I understand a soft rd to be: "alt form of X" etc.) A few days ago it was changed back to a hard rd, with a comment in the edit summary that I need to "stop doing shit like this."

As for Armenian ՙ, I don't think I ever saw it as an article, so I can only go off the edit summary. A similar situation is Armenian ՚, though in that case the hard rd was simply deleted. (I just came across these because I'm trying to remember which "Latin" punctuation marks they correspond to.)

However, we do have hard rd's for the Hindu-Arabic digits. E.g. at 0 there are a number of character boxes, and all of those characters are hard rd's to 0. There are many of them, and they appear to be stable. Like the Armenian punctuation, they are not semantically distinct, but unlike the Armenian (and Arabic) cases, they are not deprecated either.

So it's not clear to me which approach should be used when. Clearly an alt spelling should be a soft rd. But there seems to be disagreement as to how to handle characters that people may look up, when they are not semantically distinct. kwami (talk) 19:06, 20 July 2026 (UTC)

Continuation of WT:TENNIS

(Continuing discussion here as to not detract from the BP post) A few things that come to mind:

• Not all "Y-er" constructions imply a profession. For example, runner, swimmer, rock climber.
• Terms like truck driver generally imply a professional context. I admit that tennis player is not an ideal term to apply this test because stating "My cousin is a tennis player" would initially be understood as "one who plays tennis" (not implying a profession). But if I said "My cousin is a truck driver", the profession is implied.

TranqyPoo [💬 | ✏️] 17:35, 5 August 2026 (UTC)

I actually think truck driver works like tennis player, in that the "professional" implication is highly contextual. Some examples without the implication:

• A car and a truck got into an accident; the truck driver was at fault.
• "All truck drivers need to exit their vehicles now!" said the police officer.

It's true that some Y-er constructions can pretty much only be interpreted as professions (e.g. police officer), and as you note, some don't have the implication at all. It seems to depend on how likely someone is to habitually do Y without doing it professionally. E.g. I'm unlikely to speak of someone as a "lamp installer" or "lamp repairer" (or in general, an "X installer" or "X repairer") if it's not in a professional context, simply because the only people who frequently or habitually install or repair lamps are professionals. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that these implications are pragmatic more than semantic; e.g. in some strange society that was full of recreational lamp installers and still spoke English, the implication of being a professional would fall away from "lamp installer". Benwing2 (talk) 17:51, 5 August 2026 (UTC)

You make a good point and to expand: I believe that is why there are region labels in truck driver; some societies attribute truck driving as a profession rather than a hobby, habit or preference. I'm sure there are other English-speaking regions that just assume "one who drives a truck". Also, your example sentences create a specific context (the first one being "out of these two vehicles, truck driver applies to the truck; the second one I feel it's applying the professional sense or more specifically, one who drives a semi-truck. That is, I believe one who drives a consumer-grade truck could be confused if there are semi-trucks around). Nonetheless, let's examine some real uses.

• "My problem is, I can't figure out who to kill first, the duchess or the truck driver."
• If grannies and beauty queens can let one rip then it wouldn't take a genius to work out that truck drivers can too. In fact, I'm guessing that truck drivers are the kings of letting them rip.
• This book mentions truck driver and clarifies on the next page that his truck used to "haul cheese products".

Regardless whichever meaning is more common, the implied profession sense is attestable (within a general context) and it is greater than the sum of its parts. Therefore, it is worthy of inclusion. Ideally, the sense would only include the profession sense and the {{&lit}} sense. What do you think? TranqyPoo [💬 | ✏️] 19:57, 5 August 2026 (UTC)

I do understand where you're getting at. My concern is that something like "lamp installer" or "lamp repairer" would not normally be considered dictionary-worthy but has the same professional implication as "truck driver". If I were to break this down further I'd say that the implication of being a profession is part of "installer" or "repairer", and that "X installer" or "X repairer" is SOP because it's simply an installer or repairer of X. That would imply to me that the implication of profession should really be attached to "driver", and that the only thing really distinguishing "truck driver" from "lamp installer" is that the former is a much more common collocation. In fact if you look up "driver" there are a large number of similar professions listed: bus driver, cab driver, coach driver, combine driver, crane driver, engine driver, lorry driver, race car driver, shuttle driver, taxi driver, tractor driver and tram driver. The list could be greatly expanded with any vehicle that is potentially drivable as a profession. For example, if "truck driver" is non-SOP, why not also big rig driver, locomotive driver, semi driver, train driver, monorail driver, etc.? I'm sure all of these are attestable, and in fact Wikipedia has an article train driver, so it's rather strange we have "tram driver" but not "train driver". So I would say that we should add the sense of "professional driver (of some type of vehicle)" to driver and delete all of the vehicle-driver collocations that aren't maintainable by some other principle (e.g. truck driver is a translation hub and also satisfies WT:COALMINE, similarly to bus driver, taxi driver and certain others). Benwing2 (talk) 22:32, 5 August 2026 (UTC)

You make another excellent point! I'm onboard with adding the professional sense to driver and considering the terms listed above as SoP. Thank you for the chat! TranqyPoo [💬 | ✏️] 23:09, 5 August 2026 (UTC)

Template:tcl and initialisms

Unless you can think of some technical fix (probably too involved to be worth it), you should leave initialisms out of your {{tcl}}conversions. For instance, in ΕΣΣΔ the initialism is from Greek Ένωση Σοβιετικών Σοσιαλιστικών Δημοκρατιών (Énosi Sovietikón Sosialistikón Dimokratión), not English Union of Soviet Socialist Republics- just as USSR isn't from Russian Сою́з Сове́тских Социалисти́ческих Респу́блик (Sojúz Sovétskix Socialistíčeskix Respúblik). There might also be problems with other types of entries that have etymological information in the definition line, but I haven't looked into it. As it is, the only reason I found the Greek one was the "nonstandard scripts" category. Chuck Entz (talk) 23:04, 7 August 2026 (UTC)

@Chuck Entz Yes, I agree. I specifically remember running into this issue before, and I thought I had implemented a fix for it, but maybe not; or maybe the fix is present but the {{tcl}} call is incorrectly structured. In any case, I don't have any plans at this point to do any more {{tcl}} conversions. I'll see if I can find time in the next day or so to look into what I did (or tried to do) to deal with this issue, and look for other such cases. It's vaguely possible the fix is sitting in my bot's Git repository but never got propagated to mainspace. Benwing2 (talk) 23:11, 7 August 2026 (UTC)

{{m}} with inline id

I noticed this in Italian -olare:

• {{m|it|-olo<id:small>}}

  →current: -olo<id:small>

  →subst: -olo<id:small>

It seems that <id:> is being recognised making it link [[-olo#Italian: small]], but it is still showing -olo<id:small>; do you know what is going on? is it a regression?

I will just change it to {{m|it|-olo|id=small}} as a workaround; I literally cannot fix that module even if I wanted to look into it. o/ Emanuele6 (talk) 04:27, 8 August 2026 (UTC)

I checked and it seems that the inline modifier syntax has never worked with {{m}} or other single-term templates (maybe it should). Benwing2 (talk) 04:40, 8 August 2026 (UTC)

Yes, it is rather surprising that it is able to parse that id. Emanuele6 (talk) 04:47, 8 August 2026 (UTC)

Ah, no. it is actually linking [[-olo#Italian]], I guess it is simply ignoring the <...> part (maybe because they are not characters valid in links) while still showing it in the label. Emanuele6 (talk) 04:49, 8 August 2026 (UTC)

Thank you for looking into it! I guess after all it must have been my fault: I probably missed that it was rendering it weird like that when I added that {{m|it|-olo<id:small>}} copying it from the {{surf}} next to it almost a year ago, because it was not showing as a redlink. Emanuele6 (talk) 04:53, 8 August 2026 (UTC)

Archaic Latin

Placing {{tlb|la|Archaic Latin}} on a page still leads to it being classified as Old Latin, and doesn't seem to be possible to make the {{alt form of}} template work with Archaic Latin. Graearms (talk) 23:44, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

Give me a few minutes and it should be fixed. Benwing2 (talk) 23:45, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

Request to enable nci in Quotations module

I've started adding some data for common sources to a Classical Nahuatl submodule of the Quotations module, and I'd like request to have nci added to the list of enabled languages in the main module. There are only a handle of Classical Nahuatl entries that actually use the Q template so there isn't much risk of breakage. Thank you Heart-shaped-flower (talk) 03:12, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Request to add+modify placetypes in {{place}}

Bumped from Wiktionary:Grease_pit/2026/February#Request_to_add+modify_placetypes_in_{{place}}

Hi,

I request for these Philippine-related placetypes to be modified & added in Module:place/placetypes:

type	desc/change	example code	wanted output	current output	category to put entries under
barangay	For the prefix to be raw "Barangay"	barangay:pref/Camp Four	Barangay Camp Four	the barangay of Camp Four	OK, already being put in Category:Barangays
sitio	+add this prefix is just "Sitio"	sitio:pref/Km. 38	Sitio Km. 38	the sitio of Km. 38	Category:Villages
sub-sitio	+add this prefix is just "Sub-sitio"	sub-sitio:pref/Irisan	Sub-sitio Irisan	the sub-sitio of Irisan	Category:Villages
purok	+add this prefix is just "Purok"	purok:pref/Tollgate	Purok Tollgate	the purok of Tollgate	Category:Villages

{{place|en|purok|sitio:pref/Camp 6|barangay:pref/Camp Four|mun:pref/Tuba|p:pref/Benguet|c/Philippines}} should output:

A purok in Sitio Camp 6, Barangay Camp Four, municipality of Tuba, province of Benguet, Philippines

This is how these place terms are normally written. Only very few will say "the sitio of Pongayan", instead we say "Sitio Pongayan". See the third quotation in Camp 6 for an example in a news article.

--

In addition, I request for the Philippines in export.countries of Module:place/locations to be:

["Philippines"] = {the = true, container = "Asia", divs = {
 "regions", 
 "provinces", 
 "districts", 
 "municipalities", 
 "barangays",
 {type = "ABBREVIATION_OF provinces", cat_as = "abbreviations of provinces"}, --added this
 {type = "ABBREVIATION_OF barangays", cat_as = "abbreviations of barangays"}, --added this
}},

This is so that abbreviations of provinces (e.g. LU & MP) and barangays (e.g. AZCKO & MGV), have their respective abbreviation categories.

Thanks! — 🍕 Yivan000 ^view_talk 05:55, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

@Yivan000 I did the second part. The first part might require a few changes to Module:place; I'm gonna look into it. Benwing2 (talk) 04:32, 21 August 2026 (UTC)

Latin family tree gone

Do you know what happened to the Latin family tree in CAT:Latin language? It seems it disappeared today:

• 2026-07-22 https://web.archive.org/web/20260722073629/https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Latin_language
• 2026-08-21 https://web.archive.org/web/20260821040011/https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Latin_language

Incidentally, I have found "Documentation is at here" in this documentation page only editable by users with "editinterface": MediaWiki:Gadget-RegexMenuFramework.js/documentation. o/ Emanuele6 (talk 04:03, 21 August 2026 (UTC)

This can happen when someone removes a language and forgets to update the language caches. I went ahead and did this and the family tree is back. I also fixed the grammar of that page to read "Documentation is here"; it's only editable by interface admins because it's a gadget page. Benwing2 (talk) 04:12, 21 August 2026 (UTC)

removal-of-deletion-or-rfv-template exemption

As discovered in WT:Beer parlour/2026/August#removal-of-deletion-or-rfv-template exemptions(?), Special:AbuseFilter/10, a.k.a. "removal-of-deletion-or-rfv-template", has a seemingly nonsensical tagging exemption for users in the "sysop" group: & !("sysop" in user_groups).

I do not have the necessary permissions to fix the issue and remove the exemption myself. o/ Emanuele6 (talk 15:09, 13 September 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2??? Emanuele6 (talk 02:41, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

I can't determine whether there's consensus to remove the exemption. Only @-sche has commented and I'm not sure of their position. It would help if someone else chimed in. Benwing2 (talk) 02:45, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2 Is this a new problem? Emanuele6 (talk 02:48, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

What do you mean? Benwing2 (talk) 02:49, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

You have not previously declared yourself against this change, so I want to understand what the problem you are NOW bringing up is. Otherwise, what can one do about it?

Who else is opposing this change explicitly if not you right now? Emanuele6 (talk 02:52, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

Before changing an abuse filter like this, I want to make sure there is consensus for it. Benwing2 (talk) 03:33, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

Why was I not informed of this? Emanuele6 (talk 03:34, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

I don't really understand. It is normal to get consensus before making changes. You are pressing me to make a change without consensus (and also, I don't really understand why this is important to change in the first place). Benwing2 (talk) 03:41, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

@Benwing2 I don't understand why you didn't tell me before that you think one needs to get consensus to change this… You really did not do that, and it is not the first time you made me wait for no reason. WT:Beer parlour/2026/August#c-Benwing2-20260825062000-Emanuele6-20260825052600 Having people respect your request to wait, only to then revealing that the wait was for nothing, and never was meant to be for something, is very unfair.

You have to understand that you are the only person opposing this change.

What do you have to say in favour of having these exemptions? User:-sche tried to play devil's advocate likening them to the autopatroller group, however that is clearly unsound, and based on their unfortunately very flawed understanding of "autopatroller" given that there is no & !("autopatroller" in user_groups) in the filter.

It also really saddens me to hear also, I don't really understand why this is important to change in the first place, given that I linked a discussion, in which I was reporting this clear bug (I would think! If it is not according to you, I would hope you would tell why), for which I was not able to query {{rfv}} removals with https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3AContributions&target=Catonif&namespace=all&tagfilter=removal-of-deletion-or-rfv-template&start=&end=&limit=1000 , which I then discovered being & !("sysop" in user_groups) in Special:AbuseFilter/10, and asked you to fix it given that I cannot edit the filter.

Clearly, the more you intentionally let this bug (which you know about) exist, the more problems this will cause preventing people to query {{rfv}} removal from "sysop" users, as it did for me when I needed.

If you really are not willing to help me with this trivial change for personal reasons, I can try asking other people's help, but should I present you as a person opposing this change? That would change things completely… Emanuele6 (talk 04:18, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

CAT:Middle Chinese terms derived from Scythian languages

I created CAT:Middle Chinese terms derived from Scythian languages, but I see you deleted CAT:Middle Chinese terms by etymology. --{{victar|talk}} 02:30, 14 September 2026 (UTC)

That's because there are no "Middle Chinese terms derived from FOO" for any language. Part of the handling of unified Chinese is that all such categories are subsumed into "Chinese terms derived from FOO", so you should change {{bor|ltc-ear|...}} to {{bor|zh|...}}. If you disagree with this policy, I'd recommend bring it up in the Beer parlour. Benwing2 (talk) 02:35, 14 September 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation. --{{victar|talk}} 02:38, 14 September 2026 (UTC)

Quotation template and other replacements (September 2026)

Do you have time to resume carrying out quotation template replacements? If so, I'll list some below:

• If |page= is used, {{RQ:Nabokov Lolita}} → {{RQ:Nabokov Lolita|edition=US}}.

Thank you. — Sgconlaw (talk) 16:44, 25 September 2026 (UTC)

@Sgconlaw Yes, I can do these. Do you have any more? It's easier for me if you list them all so I can do them all at once. Benwing2 (talk) 02:46, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

OK, give me a few days. Thanks! — Sgconlaw (talk) 05:06, 26 September 2026 (UTC)

@Sgconlaw: I can take over the Lolita one, if you want. Jberkel 18:53, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

@Jberkel: sure, thanks! I haven't had a chance to work on any other quotation templates that require bot replacements yet. — Sgconlaw (talk) 19:15, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

 Done Jberkel 19:38, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

Interview in The Headword

I'd like to nominate you for the next interviewee in The Headword based on Justin's suggestion. What say you? Pretty please with a cherry on top? Vininn126 (talk) 17:17, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

What sorts of questions are asked? Benwing2 (talk) 17:18, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

You can see the most recent edition for a sort of "template". The exact questions are a work in progress. Vininn126 (talk) 17:19, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

To make it easier, I can copy over Justin's questions to the draft. Vininn126 (talk) 17:20, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

OK sure, I'll take a look :) ... Benwing2 (talk) 17:22, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

<3 Vininn126 (talk) 17:23, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

See Wiktionary:The_Headword/Draft/The_lexicographer. Vininn126 (talk) 17:23, 2 October 2026 (UTC)

Gentle reminder not to forget! Vininn126 (talk) 10:48, 15 October 2026 (UTC)

OK, I am willing to be interviewed. The questions you linked to are very general and could be refined to be more Wiktionary-specific, but they seem harmless enough :) ... Benwing2 (talk) 05:51, 17 October 2026 (UTC)

Yes, they need some work, any ideas you may have are welcome. Vininn126 (talk) 08:02, 17 October 2026 (UTC)

The end of the month is creeping up :p Vininn126 (talk) 07:00, 23 October 2026 (UTC)

Old English noun module causing a bug

I see that new Old English noun module now makes severe visual bug, if there was no "head=" or "1=" param in ang-noun template specified, but only gender specification followed as ye can see in Etymology 2 in the link beneath.
https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=forþweard&oldid=93383436

I think additional bot processing is needed for this. Feondulf (talk) 10:32, 4 October 2026 (UTC)

@Feondulf I believe it is not a bug. The templates have simply been edited to have a different format: rather than leaving out the head, leave that parameter empty if it doesn't need to be respelled (compare mealm).--Urszag (talk) 13:27, 4 October 2026 (UTC)

That's correct, I changed the template to put the head consistently in 1= for all part of speech templates, instead of sometimes in 1= and sometimes in head=. Benwing2 (talk) 16:14, 4 October 2026 (UTC)

Bot run cleaning up Dutch headwords had some mistakes

Hi, your latest bot run for cleaning up Dutch headwords caused some mistakes. It removed the dash in "-en" in the plurals of aardrijkskundeleraar, antiquaar, and brilstern, and messed up the genders in deze and dezelfde. I have fixed these mistakes, but thought I should let you know in case I missed something else.

Stujul (talk) 14:01, 7 October 2026 (UTC)

Oops! Thank you for letting me know. Let me check and see how this happened. Benwing2 (talk) 16:19, 7 October 2026 (UTC)

The issues you found are the only ones that occurred involving plurals and genders. Apologies for this, these were done by me using search-replace in an editor and I must have been tired when I did it; lesson for the future. Benwing2 (talk) 16:30, 7 October 2026 (UTC)

Welsh "cy-noun form" error

I just noticed an error in the headword template at merched. Since you've been working on Welsh headwords lately, I was hoping you'd know what to do to fix this. Urszag (talk) 18:28, 8 October 2026 (UTC)

I'm doing a bot run to fix all the Welsh headwords to the new format. This should use {{cy-head}} but my bot hasn't gotten to that word yet; it's about halfway through (currently handling nythu) and hasn't gotten to non-lemma forms yet. Benwing2 (talk) 18:33, 8 October 2026 (UTC)

Renaming Hamer-Banna to Hamar

Hi, can you rename Hamer-Banna to Hamar per this discussion? Saph (talk) 01:15, 11 October 2026 (UTC)

I will do this, but in the future let me do this in the right order (i.e. don't go ahead and rename the language, because it complicates matters). Thanks! Benwing2 (talk) 03:39, 11 October 2026 (UTC)